Millisecond Forums

Hi Sean,



after running the superlab script, port settings are still the same as before
(all settings are just like they are recommended for the xid mode). I
also tried unplug and replug the usb cable, but that didin't change
anything, too. Do you have another idea for the problem?



Kind regards,



Andy

I wonder if the SuperLab is automatically configuring the port settings when you run the script? You might try checking the settings in Device Manager, then running the SuperLab script, then checking them again to see if they change. That would be clue.

Another thing I've noticed is that when changing the dipswitches back and forth, I sometimes have to unplug the cable from the box in order for the changes to take effect.

-Sean

Hi Sean,



thanks for the fixes in the new version. Now we are making real progress. Here is a short summery of my test results:



Problem1: Solved!! Now I get a release scankey for all keys. The scankeys are as follwos:



-------------------------------------------------

pr.:240      pr.:112     
            pr.:208  
   pr.:16

re.:224      re.:96      
             re.:
192      re.: 0



               
pr.:144              
    pr.:176

               
re.:128              
    re.:160



               
pr.:48              
      pr.:80

               
re.:32              
      re.:64

-------------------------------------------------



Problem 2: Solved! I didn't encounter any strange scankey any more! Yep!



Problem3: Solved!



Problem4: Already Solved before!



Thanks for helping me with all these problems!!!



Unfortunately I also have a new problem with version 3.0.2.0. Inquisit
seems to have a problem with recognizing my response box, because when
I start an experiment the box doesn't work at all. This happens wtih
all my experiments as well as with the test scripts you sent me.

But!, when I start a superlab test script I do not have problems with
my boxes at all. And most interstingly after having the superlab demo
run, the box also works with Inquisit - this time perfectly with all
four problems mentioned above solved. When I then restart my computer
the problem starts again and I have to run the superlab demoscript
before I can use the response box with Inquisit. Do you have an idea
what the reason for this could be?



All the best,



Andy

Andy,

I just released Inquisit 3.0.2.0, which I believe has the fixes for the issues you discovered. I've also put together an article with detailed instruction on how to configure the response box and the serial ports for use with Inquisit. You'll find the article here.

Try downloading the new version and taking a look at the article, and let me know if you see any more issues.

Regards,
Sean

Hi Andy,

I'm in touch with Cedrus now to working to resolve this. I will post back when I get more info.

-Sean 

Hi Sean,



sorry for my delayed response. I havent't been in my office last week.

In the meantime I once again checked your test script and unfortunately
I found some wrong scankeys in that test script, too. I ran 600 trials
and for the key of the right indexfinger I once got the scancode 249
and once 105 instead of  176. (the script doesn`t test the key
releases - perhaps this might also produce some mistakes).



All the best,



Andy

Good, glad to hear we're making some progress.

A quick follow up question on issue 2 - do you still occassionally get the wrong scan code with the new test script seems I sent?

-Sean

Hi Sean,



once more thanks a lot for the test script. I think, we could already solve one of the problems with it.

I tried out your test scripts and didn't get any misses. I also removed
the posttrialpause in my script and always explicitly waited until the
next stimulus was presented. I ran the experiment several times and
didn't have any misses in it any longer. So indeed the problem with the
misses probabely was due to too fast responses. Thanks for solving that.



Issue1: In fact I do not definitly know that (I don't know too much
about the SuperLab Software), but I already contacted cedrus to
clearify that. I let you know as soon as I know more.

I also used your new test script to replicate the problem with the top
right key and I also got the problem with the new script. If I just
press one of the keys I get the correct responses for all keys ("16"
for the  top right key). If I keep one of the keys pressed after
one trial until the next "GO" appears and then release the key I get
the scankeys for the releases. This works fine for all keys except the
top right one. I do not get a release-response from this key at all.



Issue2: This happened on your former test script (from post #1420).



Issue3: Sorry, I didn't describe this problem clearly enough. For this
problem it's enough to press the key only once, but do this very fast
and with a lot of force (so that there is only very few time between a
press and a release). So this might perhaps be due to some kind of a
too short refresh rate or something comparable.



Issue 4: Solved!!



The most severe problem to me now are the keys that do not work
correctly in the xid as well as the com mode (I let you know the
response from cedrus on that).



Best,



Andy

Andy,

Issue 1: So far, I've been unable to replicate this, although I have some other ideas for testing. Does the test script you got from Cedrus register both a key press and release for the upper right key?

Issue 2: Which script does this happen on, the test script I sent, your experiment script, or both?

Issue 3: If you repeatedly knock on the keys as fast as you can, I would expect Inquisit to miss some of the key presses and releases no matter what script you are using because there will always be a brief period of time between trials when Inquisit isn't listening for a response. At the beginning of each trial, Inquisit prepares the stimuli and waits for the beginning of a screen refresh interval to present the stimulus before it starts checking for a response. Unless you are running a task that requires the participant to knock on the keys as fast as possible, this probably isn't the best way to test whether the response box is working.

Issue 4: I've run your experiment a few times but still haven't replicated this. When you've had to respond twice, is it possible you are responding before the stimulus is presented? Your trials have a 200 ms pause at the end, so any key press during that time would be ignored.

Just to narrow the testing down a bit, I've modified the test script that I posted earlier. In this new script, you have to wait until the "GO!" stimulus appears before responding, you can't just respond at any point. Can you try this new script and let me know if Inquisit is still missing key presses that occur after the go stimulus appears?

-Sean

<defaults>
/ inputdevice = XID3
</defaults>

<values>
/ response = 0
</values>

<data>
/ columns = [response latency]
</data>

<expt>
/ blocks = [1=test]
</expt>

<block test>
/ trials = [1-200=test]
</block>

<text responsefeedback>
/ items = ("Response: <% trial.test.response %>")
/ position = (50%, 50%)
</text>

<text go>
/ items = ("GO!!")
/ position = (50%, 50%)
/ txcolor = green
</text>

<trial feedback>
/ stimulustimes = [1=responsefeedback]
/ timeout = 500
</trial>

<trial test>
/ stimulustimes = [1=go]
/ branch = [if (true) trial.feedback]
/ validresponse = (anyresponse)
</trial>

Hi Sean,



the script is still the same one I sent you some days ago. I did what
you suggested and I do not get the strange scankeys pressing two keys
at on time. The keys then are as they should be - I get the strange
scankeys pressing only one key. I tried the same in the "com mode"
(/inputdevice = com3; baud rate = 9600; dipswitches 1,2,3 up, 4 down)
and here I got the problem you described: if I press two keys
simultanously the resulting scankey (a new one) is the sum of the
scankey values of the single keys. In the com mode I additionally still
have the problem that the top right and top left keys of the response
box don't work at all (as I wrote in my first post to this thread).

Please let me sum all of the problems I found with my boxes to make the issue more clear:



In the xid-mode (/inputdevice = xid3; baud rate = 115k; dipswitches 1,2,3,4 down):




1) The key up right only produces a press signal and no one for a release! (this is probabely the worst problem in the xid mode


2) Sometimes (on some trials - perhaps on of 100 or 200) I get new scankeys different from the intended scankeys.

3) If I press the keys very fast - just like knocking on them- I only
get the press key and no one for a release, too (this happens nearly
always I do that).

4) In my actual experimental script I still have some misses, when I
press on of the keys so that I have to press them twice to move on to
the next trial (this also happens only very rare perhaps about five
or six times during my actual experiment)



In the com mode (/inputdevice = com3; baud rate = 9600; dipswitches 1,2,3 up, 4 down):



1) The fact that the top right and top left key do not work at all.



---------



I also contaced cedrus and got a test script for a demoversion of
superlab and in this script all the keys of the boxes worked correctly
- as far as I can judge- so it seems to me that it is not a problem on
the hardware side (but I can't say that definitely, too).



What do you think is the most probable source of the problem? (a
mistake in my scripts and/or the testscripts - a mistake in my
installation of the drivers - a hidden problem in the hardware - a
hidden problem in Inquisit - anything else). I hope you're able to find
the problem.



Kind regards and thanks for you efforts,



Andy



p.s. please let me know if I can do anything else to assist you.